---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Matthew Hyde Date: Wed, 19 Dec 2001 09:27:13 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tactics] Warp Strafing Message-ID: <3C20A3C1.84115228@mtu.edu> -------- Guardian 2000 wrote: > > "Dalton" wrote in message > news:3C202203.DE98F6D@daltonator.net... > > Guardian 2000 wrote: > > > > > > "Dalton" wrote in message > > > news:3C1EF4C9.FE30E28@daltonator.net... > > > > Wayne Poe wrote: > > > > > > > > > > "Guardian 2000" wrote > > > > > > > > > > > > > Such as the Phoenix hanging a right in "The Wounded"[TNG]? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Phoenix wasn't AT WARP when it did that, Scoot. > > > > > > > > > > > > Actually, damn *these* streaking stars: > > > > > > > > > > > > http://ocean.otr.usm.edu/~randers2/Phoenixturning.bmp > > > > > > > > > > > > http://ocean.otr.usm.edu/~randers2/Phoenixturning2.bmp > > > > > > (In 256 colors to clear up the black space . . . I know how > > > blind > > > > > you > > > > > > are) > > > > > > > > > > Is THAT your excuse for these poorly rendered messes? And in .bmp > format > > > no > > > > > less? > > > > > > > > > > Ok, I will concede they were at warp. But the Phoenix merely making > a > > > course > > > > > change doesn't equal left or right maneuvering at warp. The Voyager > > > quote > > > > > still stands. What a surprise. > > > > > > > > Remember, banking != turning. > > > > > > WTF? A banked turn is not maneuvering at warp? > > > > Strawman, never said that. Anyway, you can bank without turning. I > > generally do it at every highway off-ramp. Of course, I usually have to > > "turn" after that, but you get the idea. > > > > You're confusing "roll" and "bank". You can roll without turning, but to > bank is part of a turning process. > > G2k Hey give the guy a break. No fat jokes please! -- Matt Hyde http://www.mathlab.mtu.edu/~mdoughy ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Dalton Date: Wed, 19 Dec 2001 21:37:23 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tactics] Warp Strafing Message-ID: <3C214EE3.C467D72C@daltonator.net> -------- Guardian 2000 wrote: > > "Dalton" wrote in message > news:3C202203.DE98F6D@daltonator.net... > > Guardian 2000 wrote: > > > > > > "Dalton" wrote in message > > > news:3C1EF4C9.FE30E28@daltonator.net... > > > > Wayne Poe wrote: > > > > > > > > > > "Guardian 2000" wrote > > > > > > > > > > > > > Such as the Phoenix hanging a right in "The Wounded"[TNG]? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Phoenix wasn't AT WARP when it did that, Scoot. > > > > > > > > > > > > Actually, damn *these* streaking stars: > > > > > > > > > > > > http://ocean.otr.usm.edu/~randers2/Phoenixturning.bmp > > > > > > > > > > > > http://ocean.otr.usm.edu/~randers2/Phoenixturning2.bmp > > > > > > (In 256 colors to clear up the black space . . . I know how > > > blind > > > > > you > > > > > > are) > > > > > > > > > > Is THAT your excuse for these poorly rendered messes? And in .bmp > format > > > no > > > > > less? > > > > > > > > > > Ok, I will concede they were at warp. But the Phoenix merely making > a > > > course > > > > > change doesn't equal left or right maneuvering at warp. The Voyager > > > quote > > > > > still stands. What a surprise. > > > > > > > > Remember, banking != turning. > > > > > > WTF? A banked turn is not maneuvering at warp? > > > > Strawman, never said that. Anyway, you can bank without turning. I > > generally do it at every highway off-ramp. Of course, I usually have to > > "turn" after that, but you get the idea. > > > > You're confusing "roll" and "bank". You can roll without turning, but to > bank is part of a turning process. Allrighty...so it's a roll. Do you have a counterargument? -- Rob "Roby" Dalton http://daltonator.net "I need a drink." "You don't drink." "Yeah, but I've been meaning to start." ---UHF ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Guardian 2000" Date: Wed, 19 Dec 2001 21:08:26 -0600 Subject: Re: [Tactics] Warp Strafing Message-ID: <9vrksv$hcca0$1@ID-82121.news.dfncis.de> -------- "Dalton" wrote in message news:3C214EE3.C467D72C@daltonator.net... > Guardian 2000 wrote: > > > > "Dalton" wrote in message > > news:3C202203.DE98F6D@daltonator.net... > > > Guardian 2000 wrote: > > > > > > > > "Dalton" wrote in message > > > > news:3C1EF4C9.FE30E28@daltonator.net... > > > > > Wayne Poe wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > "Guardian 2000" wrote > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Such as the Phoenix hanging a right in "The Wounded"[TNG]? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Phoenix wasn't AT WARP when it did that, Scoot. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Actually, damn *these* streaking stars: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://ocean.otr.usm.edu/~randers2/Phoenixturning.bmp > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://ocean.otr.usm.edu/~randers2/Phoenixturning2.bmp > > > > > > > (In 256 colors to clear up the black space . . . I know how > > > > blind > > > > > > you > > > > > > > are) > > > > > > > > > > > > Is THAT your excuse for these poorly rendered messes? And in .bmp > > format > > > > no > > > > > > less? > > > > > > > > > > > > Ok, I will concede they were at warp. But the Phoenix merely making > > a > > > > course > > > > > > change doesn't equal left or right maneuvering at warp. The Voyager > > > > quote > > > > > > still stands. What a surprise. > > > > > > > > > > Remember, banking != turning. > > > > > > > > WTF? A banked turn is not maneuvering at warp? > > > > > > Strawman, never said that. Anyway, you can bank without turning. I > > > generally do it at every highway off-ramp. Of course, I usually have to > > > "turn" after that, but you get the idea. > > > > > > > You're confusing "roll" and "bank". You can roll without turning, but to > > bank is part of a turning process. > > Allrighty...so it's a roll. Do you have a counterargument? Had she rolled, she'd have stayed on the same course. The Phoenix did not stay on the same course . . . therefore she did not roll. Or, you can just look at the damned pictures and see that there's some yawing and pitching action afoot along with the rolling. The congruence of these results in a banked turn. G2k ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Dalton Date: Wed, 19 Dec 2001 23:14:01 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tactics] Warp Strafing Message-ID: <3C216589.CF518817@daltonator.net> -------- Guardian 2000 wrote: > > "Dalton" wrote in message > news:3C214EE3.C467D72C@daltonator.net... > > Guardian 2000 wrote: > > > > > > "Dalton" wrote in message > > > news:3C202203.DE98F6D@daltonator.net... > > > > Guardian 2000 wrote: > > > > > > > > > > "Dalton" wrote in message > > > > > news:3C1EF4C9.FE30E28@daltonator.net... > > > > > > Wayne Poe wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "Guardian 2000" wrote > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Such as the Phoenix hanging a right in "The Wounded"[TNG]? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Phoenix wasn't AT WARP when it did that, Scoot. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Actually, damn *these* streaking stars: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://ocean.otr.usm.edu/~randers2/Phoenixturning.bmp > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://ocean.otr.usm.edu/~randers2/Phoenixturning2.bmp > > > > > > > > (In 256 colors to clear up the black space . . . I know > how > > > > > blind > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > are) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Is THAT your excuse for these poorly rendered messes? And in > .bmp > > > format > > > > > no > > > > > > > less? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ok, I will concede they were at warp. But the Phoenix merely > making > > > a > > > > > course > > > > > > > change doesn't equal left or right maneuvering at warp. The > Voyager > > > > > quote > > > > > > > still stands. What a surprise. > > > > > > > > > > > > Remember, banking != turning. > > > > > > > > > > WTF? A banked turn is not maneuvering at warp? > > > > > > > > Strawman, never said that. Anyway, you can bank without turning. I > > > > generally do it at every highway off-ramp. Of course, I usually have > to > > > > "turn" after that, but you get the idea. > > > > > > > > > > You're confusing "roll" and "bank". You can roll without turning, but > to > > > bank is part of a turning process. > > > > Allrighty...so it's a roll. Do you have a counterargument? > > Had she rolled, she'd have stayed on the same course. The Phoenix did not > stay on the same course . . . therefore she did not roll. > > Or, you can just look at the damned pictures and see that there's some > yawing and pitching action afoot along with the rolling. The congruence > of these results in a banked turn. Oh, so it wasn't a hard turn. Try making a sharp right going 70 and see how well your car does. -- Rob "Roby" Dalton http://daltonator.net "I need a drink." "You don't drink." "Yeah, but I've been meaning to start." ---UHF ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Matthew Hyde Date: Thu, 20 Dec 2001 12:36:23 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tactics] Warp Strafing Message-ID: <3C222196.61865F54@mtu.edu> -------- Dalton wrote: > > > Oh, so it wasn't a hard turn. Try making a sharp right going 70 and see > how well your car does. > I agree with Dalton, but Roby, you really gotta watch those friction forces :p -- Matt Hyde http://www.mathlab.mtu.edu/~mdoughy ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Dalton Date: Thu, 20 Dec 2001 14:08:18 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tactics] Warp Strafing Message-ID: <3C223722.748FFDD4@daltonator.net> -------- Matthew Hyde wrote: > > Dalton wrote: > > > > > > Oh, so it wasn't a hard turn. Try making a sharp right going 70 and see > > how well your car does. > > > I agree with Dalton, but Roby, you really gotta watch those friction > forces :p Feh. -- Rob "Roby" Dalton http://daltonator.net "I need a drink." "You don't drink." "Yeah, but I've been meaning to start." ---UHF ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Dalton Date: Thu, 20 Dec 2001 14:08:18 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tactics] Warp Strafing Message-ID: <3C223722.748FFDD4@daltonator.net> -------- Matthew Hyde wrote: > > Dalton wrote: > > > > > > Oh, so it wasn't a hard turn. Try making a sharp right going 70 and see > > how well your car does. > > > I agree with Dalton, but Roby, you really gotta watch those friction > forces :p Feh. -- Rob "Roby" Dalton http://daltonator.net "I need a drink." "You don't drink." "Yeah, but I've been meaning to start." ---UHF ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Guardian 2000" Date: Thu, 20 Dec 2001 11:47:53 -0600 Subject: Re: [Tactics] Warp Strafing Message-ID: <9vt8ds$hnhc8$1@ID-82121.news.dfncis.de> -------- "Dalton" wrote in message news:3C216589.CF518817@daltonator.net... > Guardian 2000 wrote: > > > > "Dalton" wrote in message > > news:3C214EE3.C467D72C@daltonator.net... > > > Guardian 2000 wrote: > > > > > > > > "Dalton" wrote in message > > > > news:3C202203.DE98F6D@daltonator.net... > > > > > Guardian 2000 wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > "Dalton" wrote in message > > > > > > news:3C1EF4C9.FE30E28@daltonator.net... > > > > > > > Wayne Poe wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "Guardian 2000" wrote > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Such as the Phoenix hanging a right in "The Wounded"[TNG]? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Phoenix wasn't AT WARP when it did that, Scoot. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Actually, damn *these* streaking stars: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://ocean.otr.usm.edu/~randers2/Phoenixturning.bmp > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://ocean.otr.usm.edu/~randers2/Phoenixturning2.bmp > > > > > > > > > (In 256 colors to clear up the black space . . . I know > > how > > > > > > blind > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > are) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Is THAT your excuse for these poorly rendered messes? And in > > .bmp > > > > format > > > > > > no > > > > > > > > less? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ok, I will concede they were at warp. But the Phoenix merely > > making > > > > a > > > > > > course > > > > > > > > change doesn't equal left or right maneuvering at warp. The > > Voyager > > > > > > quote > > > > > > > > still stands. What a surprise. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Remember, banking != turning. > > > > > > > > > > > > WTF? A banked turn is not maneuvering at warp? > > > > > > > > > > Strawman, never said that. Anyway, you can bank without turning. I > > > > > generally do it at every highway off-ramp. Of course, I usually have > > to > > > > > "turn" after that, but you get the idea. > > > > > > > > > > > > > You're confusing "roll" and "bank". You can roll without turning, but > > to > > > > bank is part of a turning process. > > > > > > Allrighty...so it's a roll. Do you have a counterargument? > > > > Had she rolled, she'd have stayed on the same course. The Phoenix did not > > stay on the same course . . . therefore she did not roll. > > > > Or, you can just look at the damned pictures and see that there's some > > yawing and pitching action afoot along with the rolling. The congruence > > of these results in a banked turn. > > Oh, so it wasn't a hard turn. Try making a sharp right going 70 and see > how well your car does. What does the hardness of the turn matter? Hell, the tiniest turn will put you kilometers off of your original course in less than a second, meaning that the Warsie idea of "just shoot in their flightpath, they can't turn" would be utterly screwed. G2k ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Guardian 2000" Date: Thu, 20 Dec 2001 11:47:53 -0600 Subject: Re: [Tactics] Warp Strafing Message-ID: <9vt8ds$hnhc8$1@ID-82121.news.dfncis.de> -------- "Dalton" wrote in message news:3C216589.CF518817@daltonator.net... > Guardian 2000 wrote: > > > > "Dalton" wrote in message > > news:3C214EE3.C467D72C@daltonator.net... > > > Guardian 2000 wrote: > > > > > > > > "Dalton" wrote in message > > > > news:3C202203.DE98F6D@daltonator.net... > > > > > Guardian 2000 wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > "Dalton" wrote in message > > > > > > news:3C1EF4C9.FE30E28@daltonator.net... > > > > > > > Wayne Poe wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "Guardian 2000" wrote > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Such as the Phoenix hanging a right in "The Wounded"[TNG]? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Phoenix wasn't AT WARP when it did that, Scoot. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Actually, damn *these* streaking stars: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://ocean.otr.usm.edu/~randers2/Phoenixturning.bmp > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://ocean.otr.usm.edu/~randers2/Phoenixturning2.bmp > > > > > > > > > (In 256 colors to clear up the black space . . . I know > > how > > > > > > blind > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > are) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Is THAT your excuse for these poorly rendered messes? And in > > .bmp > > > > format > > > > > > no > > > > > > > > less? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ok, I will concede they were at warp. But the Phoenix merely > > making > > > > a > > > > > > course > > > > > > > > change doesn't equal left or right maneuvering at warp. The > > Voyager > > > > > > quote > > > > > > > > still stands. What a surprise. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Remember, banking != turning. > > > > > > > > > > > > WTF? A banked turn is not maneuvering at warp? > > > > > > > > > > Strawman, never said that. Anyway, you can bank without turning. I > > > > > generally do it at every highway off-ramp. Of course, I usually have > > to > > > > > "turn" after that, but you get the idea. > > > > > > > > > > > > > You're confusing "roll" and "bank". You can roll without turning, but > > to > > > > bank is part of a turning process. > > > > > > Allrighty...so it's a roll. Do you have a counterargument? > > > > Had she rolled, she'd have stayed on the same course. The Phoenix did not > > stay on the same course . . . therefore she did not roll. > > > > Or, you can just look at the damned pictures and see that there's some > > yawing and pitching action afoot along with the rolling. The congruence > > of these results in a banked turn. > > Oh, so it wasn't a hard turn. Try making a sharp right going 70 and see > how well your car does. What does the hardness of the turn matter? Hell, the tiniest turn will put you kilometers off of your original course in less than a second, meaning that the Warsie idea of "just shoot in their flightpath, they can't turn" would be utterly screwed. G2k ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Dalton Date: Thu, 20 Dec 2001 14:09:47 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tactics] Warp Strafing Message-ID: <3C22377B.3BCFE6F5@daltonator.net> -------- Guardian 2000 wrote: > > "Dalton" wrote in message > news:3C216589.CF518817@daltonator.net... > > Guardian 2000 wrote: [snip] > > > Or, you can just look at the damned pictures and see that there's some > > > yawing and pitching action afoot along with the rolling. The > congruence > > > of these results in a banked turn. > > > > Oh, so it wasn't a hard turn. Try making a sharp right going 70 and see > > how well your car does. > > What does the hardness of the turn matter? Hell, the tiniest turn will put > you kilometers off of your original course in less than a second, This isn't the point of the argument. > meaning > that the Warsie idea of "just shoot in their flightpath, they can't turn" > would be utterly screwed. More bigotry, and of course, ignorance of canon. Try following the thread sometime. -- Rob "Roby" Dalton http://daltonator.net "I need a drink." "You don't drink." "Yeah, but I've been meaning to start." ---UHF ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Guardian 2000" Date: Thu, 20 Dec 2001 22:47:39 -0600 Subject: Re: [Tactics] Warp Strafing Message-ID: <9vuf2v$hpmr4$1@ID-82121.news.dfncis.de> -------- "Dalton" wrote in message news:3C22377B.3BCFE6F5@daltonator.net... > Guardian 2000 wrote: > > > > "Dalton" wrote in message > > news:3C216589.CF518817@daltonator.net... > > > Guardian 2000 wrote: > > [snip] > > > > > Or, you can just look at the damned pictures and see that there's some > > > > yawing and pitching action afoot along with the rolling. The > > congruence > > > > of these results in a banked turn. > > > > > > Oh, so it wasn't a hard turn. Try making a sharp right going 70 and see > > > how well your car does. > > > > What does the hardness of the turn matter? Hell, the tiniest turn will put > > you kilometers off of your original course in less than a second, > > This isn't the point of the argument. I was going back to the original point of the thread, and giving you a chance to bow out gracefully from your stupid "a turn isn't a turn dumbass" line of argument. > > > meaning > > that the Warsie idea of "just shoot in their flightpath, they can't turn" > > would be utterly screwed. > > More bigotry, and of course, ignorance of canon. "Rabid Warsie" is "bigotry", as you like to call it. "Warsie" is a group name, a shortening of "Pro-Wars debater". > > Try following the thread sometime. > I was turning it around . . . I should have realized, though, that since the concept of turning confounds you so, you'd fail to realize that. :-) G2k ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Guardian 2000" Date: Thu, 20 Dec 2001 22:47:39 -0600 Subject: Re: [Tactics] Warp Strafing Message-ID: <9vuf2v$hpmr4$1@ID-82121.news.dfncis.de> -------- "Dalton" wrote in message news:3C22377B.3BCFE6F5@daltonator.net... > Guardian 2000 wrote: > > > > "Dalton" wrote in message > > news:3C216589.CF518817@daltonator.net... > > > Guardian 2000 wrote: > > [snip] > > > > > Or, you can just look at the damned pictures and see that there's some > > > > yawing and pitching action afoot along with the rolling. The > > congruence > > > > of these results in a banked turn. > > > > > > Oh, so it wasn't a hard turn. Try making a sharp right going 70 and see > > > how well your car does. > > > > What does the hardness of the turn matter? Hell, the tiniest turn will put > > you kilometers off of your original course in less than a second, > > This isn't the point of the argument. I was going back to the original point of the thread, and giving you a chance to bow out gracefully from your stupid "a turn isn't a turn dumbass" line of argument. > > > meaning > > that the Warsie idea of "just shoot in their flightpath, they can't turn" > > would be utterly screwed. > > More bigotry, and of course, ignorance of canon. "Rabid Warsie" is "bigotry", as you like to call it. "Warsie" is a group name, a shortening of "Pro-Wars debater". > > Try following the thread sometime. > I was turning it around . . . I should have realized, though, that since the concept of turning confounds you so, you'd fail to realize that. :-) G2k ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Dalton Date: Thu, 20 Dec 2001 14:09:47 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tactics] Warp Strafing Message-ID: <3C22377B.3BCFE6F5@daltonator.net> -------- Guardian 2000 wrote: > > "Dalton" wrote in message > news:3C216589.CF518817@daltonator.net... > > Guardian 2000 wrote: [snip] > > > Or, you can just look at the damned pictures and see that there's some > > > yawing and pitching action afoot along with the rolling. The > congruence > > > of these results in a banked turn. > > > > Oh, so it wasn't a hard turn. Try making a sharp right going 70 and see > > how well your car does. > > What does the hardness of the turn matter? Hell, the tiniest turn will put > you kilometers off of your original course in less than a second, This isn't the point of the argument. > meaning > that the Warsie idea of "just shoot in their flightpath, they can't turn" > would be utterly screwed. More bigotry, and of course, ignorance of canon. Try following the thread sometime. -- Rob "Roby" Dalton http://daltonator.net "I need a drink." "You don't drink." "Yeah, but I've been meaning to start." ---UHF